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  1. Ken Case on Omni’s 2018 Roadmap

    Brent Simmons: You’re listening to The Omni Show. Get to know the people and stories behind The Omni Group’s award-winning productivity apps for Mac and iOS. Music!


    Brent: I’m your host, Brent Simmons, and I am massively relaxed today because I just got out of a massage, which is one of my favorite perks of working at Omni. That and the food. Good grief. In the studio with me today is Ken Case, the CEO of The Omni Group. Say hello, Ken.

    Ken Case: Hello, Ken.

    Brent: Thank you. Today, we’re doing a special episode. We’re looking back at last year, and looking forward to what’s coming this year. So, fair warning, it might be more than 30 minutes. It might be a lot less. It depends. We’ll just see. So, Ken. Last year was a special year, in that it was Omni’s 25th anniversary. Our listeners want to know, was there a cake?

    Ken: I’ve forgotten. Was there a cake?

    Brent: I don’t even know. Did we have a cake? We do celebrate releases with a game day, often, but there may not have been a cake. Maybe there was. I don’t know.

    Ken: I don’t know. There was a graphic on our homepage. That, I remember.

    Brent: A fancy graphic, too.

    Ken: Nice, pinball-inspired neon graphic.

    Brent: Captures the essence of the company very well. I liked that. That was cool. So, what did we get done last year? 2017. 2017. We got done free downloads. We changed the way our licensing for our apps works.

    Ken: Yeah, that was kind of a big change, and it was something that we had to think about for a number of years before we finally landed on that solution. And now that it’s done, I’ve almost forgotten about it, because it’s just part of the environment now. But for years, we had been thinking about how we sell our software in the App Store, and we were thinking about the problem of, how do we offer upgrade discounts, how do we offer free trials, how do we offer price protection? So if somebody buys OmniFocus 2 today, and we ship OmniFocus 3 tomorrow, do they have to ask Apple for a refund? Do they have to ask us for a refund? Or can we give them a free upgrade, which is what we’ve always done on our own store.

    And so, finally where we landed was, let’s separate the original download cost that’s in the App Store, which we have, where we can only offer a single fixed price, from the cost of unlocking the features of the app. So, we make that now an in-app purchase, and we let you download the app for free, and that lets you do a free two-week trial, and it lets us provide upgrade discounts where you can prove that you own an earlier version, and then we give you a 50 percent discount on your upgrades. And it lets us do price protection, so all the people who have bought OmniOutliner 2 in the last year will now be receiving a free upgrade for OmniOutliner 3 for iOS when it ships next month.

    Brent: Ah, so, sounds like a win for everybody, really.

    Ken: Yeah.

    Brent: Was it difficult, engineering-wise, to go through all this in-app purchase stuff?

    Ken: There was a lot of detail involved.

    Brent: I bet. And testing the different flows?

    Ken: Yeah. And suddenly … We try to make it simple from the customer’s perspective, where we show you … two options for buying the app, and then the free trial option. But behind the scenes, those two options for buying the app are actually something like 12 in-app purchases, or 14, depending, for all these different scenarios of, have they already purchased the standard version and now they’re unlocking Pro, and were they a prior owner or not, just all these different variants end up being a lot of complexity. And then we have to test all of those different paths and make sure that they’re all —

    Brent: I feel lucky that I personally didn’t come anywhere near any of this. That’s difficult. But, well done. It seems to be working.

    Ken: It has helped a lot. There’s still a few rough edges, that I would love to straighten out. In particular, one of the issues that we ran into with in-app purchases is that they are incompatible with the Volume Purchase Program that Apple offers for businesses. So, businesses who are trying to license our apps now can’t use the technique that Apple is steering them towards for buying apps. And so that is an issue that we have yet to resolve. That’s the big one.

    Brent: Right yeah. It continues.

    Ken: But overall, our customers have been much happier, and feedback has been great, about being able to get the discounts now, or to be able to try our apps before they buy them, and so on.

    Brent: Cool. So, last year we shipped OmniGraffle 3 for iOS, which I should point out is my wife’s favorite Omni app. She uses it on her iPad to design quilts.

    Ken: Oh, nice.

    Brent: So, yeah. All the time. She often asks me, "Oh, how do I …" and I don’t know, because I work on Outliner and Focus, but she loves that app. How did that release go?

    Ken: I think it was a really great release. We introduced a lot of big things. So, that was where we brought our free downloads, free trials and so on approach, to iOS. Also, brought the new iPad three-pane experience for the iPad Pro, that we had designed, to OmniGraffle, so now you could work on shapes and see their attributes without having to bring up a popover that showed those details, and then dismiss it, and then bring it up again, and dismiss it as you switch between your canvas and the object details.

    Brent: So this is like slide-in panels?

    Ken: Slide-in … Yeah. One for navigation on the left, and one for editing the object details on the right.

    Brent: Mm-hmm (affirmative).

    Ken: And, ah —

    Brent: It is a lot nicer than popovers.

    Ken: Yeah. And it’s what we’re moving towards now for, well for Outliner 3 and so on. But that’s a future part — We’ll talk about that later.

    Brent: Speaking of Outliner, we did ship Outliner 5 for Mac. Big upgrade. I worked a little bit on that … or quite a bit on that. I don’t remember what Outliner 4 was like, cause I’ve been working on Outliner 5 for quite a while. But I was really pleased with how that turned out.

    Ken: Yeah, me too. I think it was a really good release, a lot of features that people have asked for for years and made it into Outliner now, like being able to have persistent filters on your outline, rows that show you certain details, and let you … you can switch between them, you can save them, customize them. And I think you worked with some of that. A lot of great customization options there. As well as adding features like statistics about what you’re writing, so you have word counts and so on — also long requested. And the ability to keep your writing in the center of your window, instead of always … we used to have this problem where you stuck writing at the very bottom of your screen all the time.

    Brent: Yup. Yeah.

    Ken: And so that was the Pro version for the customers that we already had who had been asking, you know, for new features. But the other big thing that we did in Outliner 5 is we introduced the new Essentials version, a low cost version that’s just $10.00. And that version is much, much simpler and easier to use and we … the hope is that that will give people a nice entry point to outlining if it’s not something they’re familiar with, an application category that they’re not familiar with.

    Brent: Outlining always seems to me to be the kind of thing that, if you don’t know about it, and then one day you go to use it, you’re like, "How did I not have this all along?" It seems like a fundamental app that everybody needs.

    Ken: It’s one of the apps I live in all the time.

    Brent: Yeah, right. Let’s talk about OmniFocus. Last year we did faster syncing with large attachments. Sounds like a small thing, but I’m assuming to some of our customers, that’s a really, really huge issue.

    Ken: Yeah. One of the big support requests that we were dealing with related to how long it would take to sync data. And one of the big problems that we had before we made this change to OmniFocus was that if you attached a bunch of attachments, big or small really, but it’s the total size that mattered, from time to time we would coalesce the history of all of the changes that you made into one new … we call it a root transaction, a new starting transaction that represents your database. And whenever we did that, this new transaction would include all of the data that you had written up to that point, including all of these big attachments. So from time to time, we would be writing all of those attachments back to the server all over again and then every one of your devices would have to download them all over again.

    And this was a bunch of needless transfer, which, if you’re syncing to a local WebDAV server, then that’s not a big deal. If you’re syncing to the Omni Sync server from here in our office in Seattle and it’s also in Seattle, again, that’s not a big deal. But if you’re syncing to our servers from Europe or China, then that could be pretty slow, or just over a slow network connection. It could be in Montana somewhere or something. And so, the change that we made was to separate out those attachments into their own separate folder that can then live persistently on the server and each one of those attachments can be synced independently and we don’t have to keep transferring them back and forth all the time.

    Brent: So you’re not copying them. You have a single copy and then reference them somehow.

    Ken: Right. So that new root transaction just says, "And here’s where you’ll go find that attachment" instead of actually including it.

    Brent: So we’ve got a lot for OmniFocus coming up in 2018, but what else did we do for OmniFocus last year?

    Ken: Well, we rolled out these same free downloads, of course, that we talked about with OmniGraffle. But the big thing that we did, that sort of interrupted our planned schedule last year, was we made a lot of changes for iOS 11. iOS 11 brought a lot of great changes to the platform, for productivity apps in particular. It brought system-wide drag and drop, between apps on iPads, but even on an iPhone it’s useful to be able to drag and drop tasks from one project to another inside OmniFocus.

    Brent: Mm-hmm (affirmative).

    Ken: So we adopted that and it’s really great now, that you can just go to the Mail app on an iPad, drag a message into OmniFocus, and you’ll see a new task created with the details of that message. You get to drop it right into wherever you want it. It doesn’t have to go into the Inbox. Just much, much better workflow has come out of being able to do this drag and drop. And of course we did that, not just for OmniFocus, but we adopted iOS 11 across all of our products, so you can drag and drop from OmniFocus to OmniGraffle, or I should say really the other way around. You can drag an OmniGraffle image into OmniFocus, and it would make an attachment that you would attach to a task.

    Brent: Everything gets dropped in OmniFocus eventually.

    Ken: Yeah, that’s usually the directions things go.

    Brent: Makes sense. And we had support, as I recall, for iOS 11 features on day one, with at least three of our apps?

    Ken: All of our apps except for OmniOutliner because we were right … we were busy on Outliner 3 at that point.

    Brent: Right.

    Ken: And so, we didn’t wanna slow down and go back and update Outliner 2 for a bunch of iOS 11 stuff when we knew everybody that was currently buying OmniOutliner 2 would be getting a free upgrade to 3 anyway when it shipped.

    Brent: Yeah.

    Ken: It makes sense.

    Brent: It works out for us. Yeah. That’s nice. Did a little with Siri last year too, I think.

    Ken: Oh, that’s true. In fact that was the place we got mentioned in the keynote [at WWDC].

    Brent: Always an exciting moment.

    Ken: Yeah. Siri added a lot of support for third party apps to integrate with being able to manipulate lists, basically, using Siri. Now in Siri, you can say, "Have OmniFocus remind me to do something when I get home" or whatever. And now it will add that location-dependent task to OmniFocus and when you get home, you’ll get that reminder.

    Brent: Hm. People seem to love Siri. I haven’t got the hang of using it yet, myself. But I’m the only person, I think.

    Ken: It varies, I think, how much I use it. I use the "Remind me to do something" feature, for sure. Really, I think that is the thing I’ve most often used Siri for. I don’t have, "Hey Siri" turned on or anything because I value my privacy too much to have something listening to me all the time.

    Brent: Yeah, if we say —

    Ken: Even something as safe as Apple’s devices.

    Brent: If we say, "Hey Siri" too much on this podcast, people complain, because we’re waking up …

    Ken: Oh yeah. Sorry about that.

    Brent: their iPhones. Sorry! So we had a busy last year. So let’s talk about 2018.

    Ken: All right. 2018.

    Brent: We’re gonna come out, probably the first big thing will be Outliner 3.0 for iOS?

    Ken: Sort of. We’ve already … We have two minor things that we just shipped, OmniGraffle 7.6, what we sort of called the big stencils update.

    Brent: Ah, BSU — the big stencils update.

    Ken: And if you haven’t yet seen the video that we put up for that, that’s a great introduction that shows what the benefits are for this update. But basically we did a lot to improve the workflow of using stencils, where stencils live, and how you can use them, how you can manipulate them, edit them, and so on. So I would definitely recommend people check that out. And of course we have an OmniPlan update coming out. But yes, Outliner 3 is our biggest … it’s the major product release that involves a product that sells for money, as opposed to being a free update. Even though, yes, it’s a free update to anyone that’s bought in the last year. Outliner 3 brings OmniOutliner Essentials and Pro, that split, to iOS for the first time.

    Brent: Okay.

    Ken: It brings the sidebar, the slide-in pane interface, to OmniOutliner on the iPad, so now you can work with your outline and see those details either on the navigation side or on the details for your task panes, and brings filtering abilities, the ability to add and save filters, and so on. All of those are some great new Pro features. And for Essentials, for people who are new to outlining, again, it brings a nice low cost version of Outliner to the platform.

    Brent: I really enjoyed working on it. It has a great feel on iOS.

    Ken: Yeah. Again, it’s one of my most used apps.

    Brent: Yeah. And, I probably shouldn’t say it out loud, but if I didn’t work at Omni, I might just be tempted to buy Essentials, because it really is just a nice, cool, simple outliner. But, listeners, you should get Pro.

    Ken: If you’ve used an outliner in the past, you probably should get Pro, because it really does have a lot more capability than Essentials. But if you’re new to outlining and you’re not necessarily sure why you would care about filtering or why multiple columns might be useful, things like that, then by all means, go for Essentials and try it out.

    Brent: Now with our in-app purchasing, could they buy Essentials and then upgrade to Pro?

    Ken: Absolutely.

    Brent: So you can always put off making that decision.

    Ken: So we give you full credit when you upgrade from Essentials to Pro in this case. We give you whatever you paid for Essentials is discounted off the Pro price.

    Brent: Yeah, cool. OmniFocus. In some ways it looks like this is gonna be a huge year for OmniFocus. We’re working on OmniFocus 3 for iOS and 3 for Mac. Tags!

    Ken: It is —

    Brent: We’re switching to tags.

    Ken: Yeah, yeah. Well, this is kind of a long time coming. OmniFocus is now ten years old. That’s hard to believe.

    Brent: That is hard to believe. I remember Kinkless GTD like it was yesterday.

    Ken: Yeah. And when we shipped OmniFocus, it was based around the GTD model. The Getting Things Done model, by David Allen. And in that model, you have projects and you have contexts, and there is a bunch of terminology that is specific to that model. I mean, it’s not like those words were made up just for GTD, but other people who are not familiar with GTD sometimes have a little trouble wrapping their heads around what those things are and how they should use them and so on. The way that OmniFocus organizes tasks is you have … you break down your tasks into an outline basically. This started life in OmniOutliner as a set of scripts, so you build your Outliner tasks and then you assign different contexts to those tasks to say where you would like to be reminded about them, what lists you’d like to see them on, to get them done later. So I might be working on a home remodeling project or something, and I need to go get some nails. While I’m out running errands, I could also be picking up milk, which is for a totally different project, but I’d like to be reminded of both of those things while I’m out running errands. So I put both of those things in an errands context.

    So that seems simple enough, but as people … because it’s unfamiliar terminology, I think a lot of people were just confused about it, and a lot of people, for a long time, have been asking us, "Well, could we just add tags to the program?" And now, because tags is now a very familiar concept that you can just add a tag to something and it will show up in that tag list when you go looking later.

    Brent: Yeah, ten years ago, it wasn’t so common, but now —

    Ken: Now it’s part of the base operating system, but it wasn’t back then.

    Brent: Yeah.

    Ken: So, tags makes a lot of sense to call it that way, and at the same time to lift the restriction that each task would only have a single context. Now it can have multiple tags. So if you want to put it on your list for errands, that great. If you also want to put it on … tag it for today, then you can have a "Today" list that you could see it in as well.

    Brent: Yeah, that makes sense. I think it might have been Curt Clifton who said something about having tags for different energy levels too.

    Ken: Yeah.

    Brent: Like if he’s feeling energetic, he might do this, or ignore it if he’s not.

    Ken: Some people order tags for energy level, for priorities, for locations. My only caution would be, just because it’s possible now to add as many tags as you want to a task, that doesn’t mean that it’s a good idea to go overboard with tagging everything as much as possible. The goal of capturing data at all into OmniFocus is to check it off and if you’re spending more time capturing it than you are checking it off and getting the thing done itself, then that’s not a very good use of your time. You want to get things out of this list, not curate a perfect list itself.

    Brent: So if you look at your to-do list as a garden you’re growing, that’s wrong, but if you look at it like bowling pins, you’re right. Okay.

    Ken: Yeah. But that said, for some people, if we don’t let you organize the work [in the way] that makes the most sense to you, then we’re getting in the way of getting those things done. So we wanted to give the flexibility to make some of those choices and figure out what workflow works for you.

    Brent: Ah, that’s cool. One change I saw coming … my wife in particular has asked for, and that’s manual sorting inside tags. So if you have a "Today" tag, you can actually put stuff in the order you want rather than assigning fake due dates or times to stuff.

    Ken: Yeah, absolutely.

    Brent: That sounds really cool.

    Ken: That’s I think a pretty huge feature for at least some subset of people. As you said, in the past you could kind of work around this by maybe setting due times at different times of the day that were earlier or later or maybe you could set estimated times and sort your tasks by their estimated duration, but all of those were just time wasters. It was getting in your way instead of getting the task done. So now, it’s great that you can just go to any tag, reorder it however you want. It only affects the order in that list, but it does remember it, and it does sync it between devices.

    Brent: Oh that’s cool.

    Ken: So you can set that "Today" tag up the way you want on your Mac and then when you look at it on your iPhone later, you see those things on that list.

    Brent: Mm-hmm (affirmative)- So we’re doing more with flexible scheduling too. I understand we’re working on enhancements to repeated tasks?

    Ken: Yeah. So dates, of course, are incredibly important in any task management system, and one of our most common feature requests for years, has been, "Well, could we have more flexible ways of scheduling repeating tasks?" So that, maybe I have a meeting that happens every second Wednesday of the quarter, and so I can’t just say, I want to repeat this every three months, the way OmniFocus 2 would allow because that would be on a particular day of the month and that day is not always the Wednesday.

    Brent: Right.

    Ken: So we wanted to add more flexibility to how you could schedule your work. But at the same time, the more flexibility we add, if we’re not careful, that flexibility quickly turns into a very complicated interface …

    Brent: Hmm. That’s true.

    Ken: … that is intimidating, or just distracting and hard to use. So we also restructured the way we do our scheduled repeats so that we can avoid overwhelming people with a bunch of decisions that they might not care about. If I’m setting up a repeating task that happens every day, I don’t need to worry about which week it is, of the month or something.

    Brent: Ah, right, you can hide that. Yeah.

    Ken: So we start out asking, "Do you want to repeat at all?" And then we ask the period, and then we start to delve into the details of what the period is and whether that period is from completion or if it’s on a fixed repeatable schedule. The very last thing we ask these days, instead of being the first thing that we ask, the way we used to.

    Brent: Mm-hmm (affirmative). Okay.

    Ken: Which was sort of how we had implemented it, so it made sense from our point of view, but it didn’t make sense to ask that if it didn’t matter, like sometimes you don’t have to worry about that question. So we might as well wait until the very end to ask it.

    Brent: So this is progressive disclosure, I guess is the term for this.

    Ken: Yeah, the term we call it … that’s actually a term that I learned during the unveiling of the Aqua interface for Mac OS X. When the new save panels were introduced and they talked about progressive disclosure of being able to enter a name into that Save panel, but not show you all the details of your folder hierarchy unless you wanted it. And if you did want it, then there was a little expansion button you could hit and you could then see those details. And so you still had all the flexibility that was possible before, but for simple tasks, all you had to do was pick a name, hit return, and you were done, or you could select a favorite location from a pop-up in that case.

    Brent: Mm-hmm (affirmative)- Ah, makes sense to adopt that. Cool. So we’re doing more flexible notifications as well.

    Ken: Yeah.

    Brent: I understand a lot of people have asked for different features about notifications.

    Ken: Well maybe I should back up and note that OmniFocus started out its life without any notifications at all because the systems didn’t start out with any notification APIs.

    Brent: Yeah, right.

    Ken: When you were on the Mac ten years ago, there was Growl. And we did support Growl, but there was nothing built into the system that … the way it is now. And on iOS, there were no notifications at all to start with. If you’re app wasn’t running, then the app wasn’t running, and that was it.

    Brent: Oh, yeah. I forgot about that, and there one app running at a time. There was no background. Yeah.

    Ken: So of course, we have added notifications, and we have adopted backgrounds, all sorts of things over the years, as the operating system has become more powerful, but one of the areas where we realized we had a lot more options available now than we did when we last built notifications, and what you see when you receive a notification on … and I’m talking right now particularly about on iOS devices, and on iPhones where you can do the deep pressing on it, on a notification.

    Brent: Mm-hmm (affirmative)

    Ken: So now when you see something … in the past when we would send a notification — because we didn’t want to overwhelm you with, say, twenty notifications at once for a project that was becoming due, and it had twenty tasks in it, and they all were becoming due, we might say that this is becoming due, and twenty more things, or three more things, or whatever. And that was because we were sort of limited in what we could put in notification. We just had a message and maybe some actions, a sound …

    Brent: Mm-hmm (affirmative).

    Ken: … and that was about it. But now we can actually provide our own custom interface for that and so we do, and it will show you a list of all of those tasks, in the context of the project that’s due.

    Brent: Oh, okay.

    Ken: So it’s a much, much nicer picture of what’s going on. There will be a … well I guess by the time you’re hearing this, listener, there are screen shots on my blog post that show how this works. We can also display a map for the location based notifications.

    Brent: Oh, that’s good.

    Ken: So if you had a reminder to do something when you’re at the Space Needle, then when you get there, we’ll show you a map to where the Space Needle is from where you are.

    Brent: All Seattleites are surprisingly near the Space Needle, often, it seems like. It’s in walking distance from here, actually.

    Ken: It’s true.

    Brent: So we’re five years into iOS 7. Is that continuing to affect our designs? Is OmniFocus gonna look or feel any different in the coming year?

    Ken: So thinking back again to ten years ago of OmniFocus, when … well, ten years ago, we didn’t have OmniFocus on the iPhone. Nine years ago, we did have OmniFocus on the iPhone, or nine and a half years ago.

    Brent: Wow.

    Ken: Because we were there at the launch of the App Store. And at that time, the way apps were designed, of course, looked very photorealistic. You know, people were putting leather in their apps, or felt, or different wood grains, and so on, to try to make it look like the real world objects that they might be representing. In a lot of ways, all of those graphics … it was beautiful in some ways and it was also kind of distracting in some ways, from letting you see the underlying structure of an app.

    Brent: Mm-hmm (affirmative)

    Ken: In OmniFocus 2, we were right in the process of doing our new design. In fact, we’d already presented it at Macworld, what our new design was going to look like. When Apple announced iOS 7 and showed us their completely different direction for iOS that moved completely away from all of those skeuomorphic designs and instead we had a sea of white everywhere.

    Brent: Yeah, with those thin fonts too.

    Ken: Thin fonts, thin icons. Instead of icons being filled in, they were all line art, and so on. And it was a very clean look, and I think it was an important counter to where we had been.

    Brent: We had to bend the stick back, I think.

    Ken: Right.

    Brent: Yeah.

    Ken: But it was a bit extreme as well.

    Brent: Yeah.

    Ken: So, while OmniFocus 2 … in OmniFocus 2 we adopted a lot of that. Like I said, line art icons. We even … some of the recommendations from iOS 7’s human interface guidelines were to use font faces in font types, to indicate hierarchy instead of using things like indentation, which we’d been using before, or icons that we’d been using before.

    Brent: Huh.

    Ken: And so for some of our customers, that was fine, but for others, they felt like now they lost their road maps. Their eyes no longer had sort of a good sense … things to hang onto to give them a sense of place and where they were. And we tried to provide some of that in our app by changing the colors subtly, as you go from one section to another. So in Projects, the colors are different than when you’re in the Contexts list for example, or in maps, and so on. But, it’s been five years now, and I think Apple has certainly …

    Brent: Are we going back to green felt?

    Ken: They have not gone back to green felt! But they have started filling in their icons and bringing in some more subtle cues, visual cues that help you find your way around the system.

    Brent: A little shading, a little indentation.

    Ken: Yeah.

    Brent: Occasional borders around things.

    Ken: Yeah, I sometimes forget that, on some of my devices at least, on my iOS devices, I’ve turned on the accessibility feature that adds borders around buttons, and so I forget some times, oh yeah, the basic experience doesn’t even have those. You just have some bare text laying out there and the only way you know it’s a button is that it’s tinted like a button.

    Brent: Yeah. It looks great until I find myself tapping on something, or I want to do something and I have no idea where to tap.

    Ken: Right.

    Brent: Yeah, so.

    Ken: So in OmniFocus 3, we are coming back a bit ourselves. We’re bringing back more icons. We bringing back more indentation to help give you a sense of that structure that the app has, that it’s always had, but maybe wasn’t as visible in OmniFocus 2.

    Brent: So it’s some of the classic techniques of user interface design, but without …

    Ken: But without some —

    Brent: … going crazy.

    Ken: Not necessarily with green felt.

    Brent: Yeah. That’s sensible. So, Omni Automation, OmniJS, JavaScript on automation is … we’ve rolled it out in which of our apps so far?

    Ken: Right now it is in OmniGraffle 7 on Mac, OmniOutliner 5 on Mac, OmniGraffle 3 on iOS, and it’s in the current test flight builds of OmniOutliner 3 … is that what it … OmniGraffle 3 and OmniOutliner 3 on iOS. Yeah. It will be in Outliner 3 when that ships next month. So.

    Brent: So Focus 3 will be, OmniFocus 3 will be getting this too, I imagine.

    Ken: Yes, I’m not sure whether it will be ready in time for 3.0. I don’t necessarily want to hold 3.0 back if that’s not ready yet. But it’s certainly part of the 3.1, 3.2 road map.

    Brent: So likely this year then.

    Ken: But this year, for sure. Yes.

    Brent: Cool. That sounds good. And I imagine there would be a lot of Focus users who would be quite happy to have some automation, particularly the ones who have been using AppleScript on their Mac.

    Ken: I expect so. We have always had a lot of strong automation support in OmniFocus for the Mac and people have been using that for years to do things like manipulate templates or do reporting, and so on, and find out the stats of how many things they closed this week, and so on.

    Brent: Hm.

    Ken: I think being able to do that in dual platform, where it works on both Mac and iOS and —

    Brent: So the same script will work in both places.

    Ken: Yes.

    Brent: That’s pretty cool.

    Ken: And it will be much faster than AppleScript was, so that will also be useful. I think it will be a very popular feature, as it rolls out.

    Brent: I like the choice of JavaScript because it’s so much the language that people are most likely to know, at least a little bit, if they know any languages.

    Ken: Yeah, in terms of scripting languages out there, I think it’s the one most … it’s most likely for people to be familiar with.

    Brent: So are we doing any collaboration features?

    Ken: Ooh, that is a big one. Yes we are. Again, not for 3.0.

    Brent: Okay.

    Ken: I should back up. OmniFocus has been designed as a tool that helps people manage their own personal work. It’s not really designed as a tool for collaboration. But for many of us, our work involves collaborating with other people.

    Brent: We’re all introverts, we all wish it didn’t, but it does.

    Ken: Unless we somehow manage to really be a hermit up on the mountain — which I recently learned those people do exist — then we probably have some things that involve us waiting for somebody else to finish something or somebody else waiting for us to finish something.

    Brent: Mm-hmm (affirmative)

    Ken: While I don’t think OmniFocus is the best tool for coordinating very large interdependent project schedules and … We make OmniPlan for that kind of work.

    Brent: Right.

    Ken: I do think that there is a place for automatically relaying status updates between shared tasks for people.

    Brent: Hm. Okay.

    Ken: For specific tasks. So for OmniFocus 3, what we’re doing is we’re adding support for linking tasks between unrelated databases. So I can have a task that I send you, and you’ll receive it with its notes and attachments and due date, sort of the essentials of the task. And when I send it to you, I am proposing that our task should be linked. And you can choose, when you receive that, whether you want to accept that link or not.

    Brent: Okay.

    Ken: If you accept the link and all those tasks are linked, we both get to see updates to that task. So if I check it off complete, then you’ll see that and vice versa. But it’s just that specific task. In each of our tasks, in each of our databases, that task can live wherever we want and have whatever relationship to other tasks that we want.

    Brent: Mm-hmm (affirmative)

    Ken: So maybe in my database I have a whole bunch of subtasks for that task, and I didn’t send those subtasks to you, I just sent you, "Here’s the overall status of this group of things", it’s its own project. And maybe in yours, you’re waiting for me to finish that before you finish something else, and so it’s a step in one of your projects, a sequential project, and so it’s blocking the other action from becoming available.

    Brent: I see, yeah. That makes sense. Yeah. That’s pretty cool.

    Ken: So I feel like that’s a good way to let people continue to manage their own personal work however they wish, but other people are not somehow inserting themselves into my database, or me into their database, and us arguing over what tags should exist, or …

    Brent: Right.

    Ken: But while solving the basic problem of making it easier to communicate shared status between individuals.

    Brent: That’s cool.

    Ken: Between collaborators.

    Brent: Yeah, it’s peer to peer, rather than having someone from above control your OmniFocus and thereby what you do.

    Ken: Or just a big "wild west" database, where we’re both seeing a common shared database and who knows what’s changed since the last time we looked.

    Brent: Yeah. Are we gonna do OmniFocus for windows? People always ask. I gotta ask. Or Android?

    Ken: Aah.

    Brent: It’s the one time in the podcast where Ken asks to say no. I’ll say it for you. No, we’re not doing OmniFocus for Windows or Android. How about the web?

    Ken: Yes, we are gonna bring OmniFocus to those screens.

    Brent: Yes! Okay. I like that answer.

    Ken: Thinking back over all these features that we’re adding to OmniFocus 3, we’ve actually hit a lot of the things that the customers have asked us for, over the years, except for this last bit, which is, "What if I am at work? I’m forced to use a Windows PC there, and I wanted to look at my task list, or I wanted to add a few things or I want to check some things off?" And to date, we have not really had a good solution for customers for that. So, details in the blog post, but yes, we are building a limited OmniFocus for the web. It’s not going to have all the custom perspectives, and you won’t be able to … It’s not meant to be it’s own stand-alone thing. It’s meant to be a tool that you can use in partnership with our existing OmniFocus apps.

    Brent: Okay.

    Ken: When you’re away from home, we call it, and you need to access that data.

    Brent: Will this cost extra for OmniFocus users?

    Ken: It’s gonna cost extra for us to provide it, so we’re going to need to … we need that to be self-supporting. So we will be charging some fee. I don’t know what that fee will be yet.

    Brent: Yeah.

    Ken: Because we have not worked out what all those costs are.

    Brent: Sure.

    Ken: But hopefully not unreasonable.

    Brent: Right.

    Ken: And it will of course be optional. We’re not turning OmniFocus into a subscription priced app or something. This is an optional fee for those who want that remote access and need, then, for us to provide this new service.

    Brent: Hm. Given how often this comes up, I think this is gonna make a lot of people happy.

    Ken: I hope so. It’s a lot of work, if it didn’t make them happy!

    Brent: Yeah, right. It wouldn’t have to be the whole experience. If you’re at work, maybe you just do need to see what’s on tap for today or check a few things off, or something. I think that’s great.

    Ken: Yeah, I think for most people, if you’re able to access your custom lists under your tags, and to be able to add new things to your Projects or inbox and manipulate things there, then … Well, we’ll see. I’d love to hear from people who are interested in this and to get feedback about whether this sounds like something that they’re interested in.

    Brent: Mm-hmm (affirmative)- Very cool. So will we be doing a beta testing, a TestFlight thing for OmniFocus?

    Ken: Ah. Of course we will, yes. I’m starting to be a little … yeah … no. I shouldn’t joke in this context. Yes, we expect to start the TestFlight for OmniFocus 3 this quarter.

    Brent: Okay.

    Ken: Sometime … and since the first month is now approaching its end, that means in the next two months I guess.

    Brent: February, March. Okay. Yeah. Cool. And in the show notes, I’ll put a link to the blog posts, which then have a link to the TestFlight sign-ups, so people can check that out.

    Ken: In fact, we’ve already started laying the groundwork for that with some TestFlight builds of OmniFocus 2 that are sync compatible with OmniFocus 3, because we don’t want people to have to throw out all of their … we want people to be able to use their existing databases and sync back and forth between OmniFocus 3 and OmniFocus 2, in case there’s a bug they run into in OmniFocus 3 [beta], they can work around it by just going to OmniFocus 2 and doing the work there.

    Brent: OmniFocus is also, I’ve noticed, very good about making back-ups of things too, so … Always treat beta software carefully, but it does back the data up, which is good.

    Ken: Yeah, since we live in these apps ourselves, it’s always been important to us to make sure that this data gets preserved. So in OmniFocus for Mac, for example, I think it does daily back-ups for a month or something. I don’t …

    Brent: Yeah, something like that.

    Ken: Lots of checkpoints that you can get back to in case something isn’t the way you expect it. So.

    Brent: Well that just about covers it, I think. Am I forgetting anything important? Are we gonna have cake in 2018?

    Ken: I think that covers the road map. I’m sure we’ll have cake from time to time.

    Brent: There’ll at least be cookies.

    Ken: Yeah.

    Brent: Well, thank you, Ken.

    Ken: And mac and cheese.

    Brent: And mac and cheese, yeah. Yeah. The food’s so good every day. Today was Greek lunch. I love … and hummus and everything. It was so good.

    Ken: Yeah. Greek lunch is one of my favorite meals here.

    Brent: Yeah. Of course, another of my favorites is the farmer’s lunch, which is just like a whole bunch of different things, cheeses and cold cuts, and breads, and stuff. The only problem with that is that’s the one where the line is super slow. Oh, it’s farmer’s lunch, oh, hmm, all right.

    Ken: All right. I’ll set a timer for 15 minutes and come up then.

    Brent: Hey Siri, remind me … Oh sorry, listeners. Well, thank you Ken. How can people find you on the web?

    Ken: Well, of course, if they follow the show notes … the blog post. I’ll have some notes there, but you can find me on Twitter @kcase and you can also send me email at

    Brent: KC. Did people ever used to joke about KC and the Sunshine band with you?

    Ken: Occasionally.

    Brent: Yeah, I thought so. Well, I’d also like to thank our intrepid producer, Mark Boszko. Say hello, Mark.

    Mark Boszko: Hello, Mark.

    Brent: And especially, I want to thank you for listening. Thank you. Music!


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    Enjoy this crossover into analog productivity!


    The Sketchnote Army Clothing Collection! A variety of t-shirts and sweatshirts available for sale at Teespringthat support Sketchnote Army and look fashionable at the same time! to Season 4, Episode 2 of the podcast on SoundCloud:


    You can subscribe to the podcast through iTunes:




    What is bullet Journaling? And Ryder’s superhero origin story


    Sharing with a friend

    Putting the Bullet journal online

    Gained from other sharing, so he shared

    Picked up on Lifehacker

    Simplified to basics

    Not everything took off “Is this something I want to exist?”

    Removing friction and making things to make things a little easier

    The limits of Analogue and the Bullet Journal App

    Process and Product benefits of Bullet Journaling

    Try it for 2 months

    Sketchnoting & bullet journaling together

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    Ryder’s Three Tips

    Ryder also can’t match Pinterest bullet journals

    Get out of it whatever you can


    Keep it simple

    Make it your own

    Be patient with yourself


    Ryder on Twitter

    Ryder’s website

    Bullet Journal Website

    Bullet journal on Instagram

    Iterative process

    SeanWes Overlap Book

    SeanWes Free or Full Price

    Bullet Journal Kickstarter

    Bullet Journal notebook

    Bullet Journal App

    The Bullet Journal in Lifehacker

    DaVinci’s notebooks


    Season 1

    Season 2

    Season 3

    Special thanks to Christopher Wilson for the show notes!

    Give us advice!

    We want to make sure our podcast provides great insights for your sketchnoting journey.

    Subscribe to the podcast and

    share your thoughts.

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  9. ProBlogger Podcast

    Why Evergreen Content is the Best Investment of Time for a Blogger

    “If you could only write one type of content on your blogs – what would it be?” I was asked this question while on a Q&A panel back in 2007 while at a conference in Las Vegas.

    It’s a question that I go back to again and again, and the answer hasn’t changed a bit. I also think writing this type of content is why I have had success over the last 13 years.

    One of the most important things I’ve done in my blogging has been to focus on writing one particular form of content above all others – that being evergreen content.

    Evergreen content is content that stays fresh for your readers. It’s as relevant years after being written as it was the day it was written.

    In Today’s Episode Examples of Evergreen Content

    This episode is available to listen to on iTunes here.

    ISO Settings in Digital Photography – I wrote this in 2007

    10 Ways to Take Stunning Portraits – Introductory type guide post

    Rule of Thirds – Posts with varying lengths

    How to Make An Inexpensive Light Tent – Classic step-by-step post

    Long Exposure Photography: 15 Stunning Examples – 15 inspirational images

    Posing Guide: 21 Sample Poses to Get You Started with Photographing Women – Part of a series and all about images

    Can You REALLY Make Money Blogging? [7 Things I Know About Making Money from Blogging] – A frequently asked question

    The Ultimate Guide to Making Money with the Amazon Affiliate Program – A mega-guide

    How to Craft a Blog Post – 10 Crucial Points to Pause – Introduction to a 10-part series

    How to Quit Your Job, Move to Paradise and Get Paid to Change the World – Guest post that doesn’t ‘teach’ it ‘tells’

    10 David Ogilvy Quotes that Could Revolutionize Your Blogging – A light topic, but a popular topic when it comes to searches – quotes from David Ogilvy

    Examples of Evergreen Content Submitted by Facebook Followers

    What is the best age to go to Disneyland?

    11 Habits of Successful Women

    DIY: Upcycle regular jeans into skinny jeans!

    Bunting Tutorial

    The Ultimate Guide to Airline Baby Bassinets

    The Two Types Of Data You Need To Know About

    Cleaning Mould off Canvas

    Fairy Playdough Recipe

    Foods vs. Supplements: The Turmeric vs. Curcumin Edition

    All of the Examples Submitted on Facebook

    Further Resources on Evergreen Content the Best Investment of Time You’ll Ever Make as a Blogger

    Tim Ferriss – Evergreen Content – 78th Episode Snippet

    Paleo Salted Choc Caramel Slice Recipe – Content people come back to

    10 Sure-Fire Headline Formulas That Work – Content I’d go back to

    MacRumors Buyer’s Guide – Frequently updated

    Lifehacker Pack for Mac: Our List of the Essential Mac Apps – Updated

    Bali: Where to Shop – Updated annually

    The 19 Most Popular DSLRs Among our Readers – Most Popular on dPS

    The 30 Most Popular DSLR Lenses with our Readers – Most Popular on dPS

    The 19 Most Popular Compact System and Mirrorless Cameras with Our Readers – Most Popular on dPS

    Make Money Blogging

    What New (and Old) Bloggers Need to Know about SEO

    How to Turn Surfers into Blog Readers by Building a Sticky Blog

    Types of Posts That Can Be Evergreen

    Long Exposure Photography: 15 Stunning Examples – Inspirational Content

    Choosing a Blog Platform – Advice

    Different Mediums

    Secrets of Making Money Online – YouTube

    Long Exposure Photography: 15 Stunning Examples – Image Collection



    Full Transcript

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    Hey there, it’s Darren from ProBlogger and welcome to Episode 136.

    “If you could only write one type of content on your blogs forever, what would it be?” This is the question that I was asked back in 2007 while I was in Las Vegas at a blogging conference. I was in this Q&A Panel and I was asked this question by someone on the floor, I wish I knew who it was because it’s a question that I’ve gone back to time and time again. I’ve particularly gone back to the answer that I gave on that particular day.

    The answer I gave that day, I hadn’t really thought a whole heap about. It was just something that came to mind in the moment as I was asked the question. But in answering the question, I unlocked a bit of a secret. I had this realization that a lot of what I’d done over the last three years of my blogging already had set me up and had helped me to grow my blogs to that point.

    I’ve been blogging for four or five years at that point and in that moment in answering that question, I realized what I’d been doing. It really shaped the years that have followed. Over the last almost fourteen years of blogging now, I have focused almost 95% of my time creating a certain type of content and that’s what I want to talk about today. What type of content should you be focusing your time upon creating?

    If you really want a bang for your buck, if you really want a good return on investment in terms of the time that you put into content, I want to share with you the type of content that I think you should be at least dedicating some time to every week.

    You can find today’s show notes and there’s going to be quite a few of them today because this will be a meaty podcast, I’ve got a lot to go through with you today. I want to share with you what this type of content is. I want to tell you why it’s so powerful. I want to give you some examples of this type of content, a variety of different examples both from my blogs and also some of my readers. I also want to share with you some ideas on how to come up with this type of content for your own blog. There’s a variety of different approaches that you can have.

    Make yourself comfortable, grab yourself a beverage, and go over to where I will include all the show notes and there will be links to all the examples that I give you today. Thanks for listening and let’s get into this particular episode.

    What type of content is the best type of content to focus upon creating for your blog? Whilst there is never a single answer to this type of question because every blog is a little bit different, I want to talk about the approach that I have taken with the vast majority of the content that I’ve created. Over the last thirteen years, I tried to work out the other day how many pieces of content I’ve published on my blogs. I don’t really know because my first blogs do not exist anymore and I can’t actually see how many pieces of content are there, but it’s well over 20,000 pieces of content that I’ve created just on my blogs. You can add into that a whole heap of social media posts as well.

    There’s over 8,000 posts alone on ProBlogger, blogpost and podcast added together. There’s over 6,000 on Digital Photography School. Just on my main two blogs, there’s 14,000 pieces of content there and then I’ve got a whole heap of other content on previous blogs that I’ve had as well.

    One of the things I’ve done in preparation for today’s podcast is look back over some of the best content that I’ve created in terms of how many people have viewed it. One of the things that I’ve noticed as I look back at the most read content that I’ve created is that the vast majority of it is what I would call evergreen content.

    Evergreen content is a terminology that you may have heard before. For those of you who don’t, evergreen content is content that stays fresh for your readers. It’s as relevant today years after being written as it was on the day that it was written. It doesn’t date I guess would be another way to describe it.

    I want to say right upfront, I’m sure that there are plenty of examples of blogs that are very successful, that don’t focus upon evergreen content. I’m not saying that this is the only way to create a blog is to create evergreen content. I’ve actually had a blog, one of my first commercial blogs that was very much the opposite. It was very now content, it was about digital cameras and what was being released today. It was all about the new technologies. There’s plenty of examples of blogs that do well with that sort of more now focused content.

    As I look at my most successful blogs, the content that has been the basis for those success has been evergreen content. I’m going to share with you a whole heap of different examples of that type of content from both ProBlogger, Digital Photography School. If you’re looking at the show notes, you’ll also see I’m including some links to some of my readers’ evergreen content as well to give you some examples of that, hopefully to stimulate some ideas for your own blog.

    I’m not the only one who things that evergreen content is great, there’s been many blog posts written around the web for that and you can do a search for evergreen content and find a whole heap of great advice on it. I want to encourage you to listen to this really short snippet from Tim Ferriss’ Podcast. I’m using this with permission from Tim, thank you Tim for allowing me to share it. This comes from his 78th episode, it’s from May 27, 2015. It’s a really good episode where Tim is asked a whole heap of questions by his readers. In this particular segment, he’s asked how he would build his blog audience again if he was just starting out today.

    “If you’re building an audience, the most labor efficient way to build an audience over time is to have evergreen content. I write long pieces that will be more valuable from an SEO real estate standpoint two years from the day I write it compared to the week it launches, if that makes sense.

    Were you to look at my back catalog and the stats—I’m on WordPress VIP—or Google Analytics, you would see that my most popular post that each get hundreds of thousands of visits per month were written several years ago. That’s very much by design, I’m not upset by that because I fully expect that some of the articles I write this year, for instance my post on Practical Thoughts on Suicide which is a very intense post, I expect that will continue to gather steam and be spread around and shared and a year from now will be right in the Top 10 rankings which is very important to me.”

    Thanks again, Tim, for allowing us to share that snippet. I do recommend that you go and check out Episode 78 of Tim’s podcast. I’ll link to it in today’s show notes as well because Tim does go on to talk a little bit more about long form content which, the two elements for him, evergreen and long form content. That’s certainly a powerful approach.

    Today, I just want to really focus in on evergreen content. This is content, as Tim says, it’s going to be as valuable in a couple of years time, perhaps be even more valuable and getting more traffic in a couple of year’s time than perhaps it is on the day that he publishes it.

    Why is evergreen content a great investment? I think it should be already seeing it. It continues to serve your readers as much in the future as it does the days that you write it. The value that you’re creating. That is a powerful thing to know that the piece of content that you’re going to publish today is going to have a positive impact upon people in ten year’s time potentially is a pretty amazing thing. That piece of content has the ability to make the world a better place for a longer period of time. That’s purely just from an altruistic kind of perspective, I think that’s a great thing.

    In terms of traffic, and that’s what Tim’s really talking about here, it’s something that will continue to be searched for again and again. If you choose the right topics, something that is relevant today but also will continue to be relevant in the future, I’ll give you some examples of these in a moment. That potential lead can bring in as much traffic today. If you pick the right topic in an area that’s growing, you might be spotting a trend within your niche that you think is going to be the next big thing for the next ten years and it’s actually going to grow, then that is even better than something that’s just sort of already plateaued.

    Evergreen content is the type of content that you can refer people from future blog posts back to. Many of the examples that I’ll give you a little bit later, pieces of content that I’ve written on Digital Photography School and ProBlogger which are kind of cornerstone pieces of content that I continue to drive traffic back to from my future posts. It’s really useful to have those types of pieces of content in your archives ready to go so that you can link it back to those types of things.

    Evergreen content is the type of content that you can link to from your navigation, from your menus, from your side bars. If you go to right now, you’ll see in the side bar of our blog post that from those blog posts we actually have sort of little banner ads for some of our evergreen pieces of content.

    We have a post that I wrote a few months ago now called How to Start a Blog in Five Easy Steps. That’s linked to from every blog post on ProBlogger, that’s an evergreen piece of content. I know that piece of content isn’t going to date. It may date slightly in terms of some of the technologies, but I can update that.

    My How to Make Money Blogging post is an evergreen piece of content. I’ve had that live on ProBlogger now for many, many years. Yes, I do update it from time to time, tweak it a little bit, but it’s an evergreen piece of content that I continue to drive traffic to from blog posts but also from our navigation.

    Evergreen content is the type of content that you can continue to share and re-share in social media. This is one of the frustrating things about having a blog that has very much “now” content, that dates very quickly, is that you may have a very short window that you can be sharing the content that you’re creating.

    If I do a review of a new camera, I can share that on social media for maybe a couple of months and it will still be relevant. Six months later, that camera has already been superseded by a new one, Canon will release a new one every six or so months so supersede their old ones. I can’t really continue to re-share that review.

    But if I have a blog post that is not dated at all, I can share that every month for the next ten years if it’s the right piece of content. Every month might be a little bit overkill but many of the pieces of content that I am sharing on Digital Photography School’s Facebook page were written ten years ago and haven’t been really changed much at all since that point because they’re on topics that are still as relevant today. That gives you a growing library of content that you can continue to re-share. If you use a tool like Meet Edgar, which we use on our Twitter streams, that can become a very automated thing. It can really help you to cut down the work that you’re doing in terms of the sharing of content.

    Evergreen content is the type of content that once you have it and it’s working in one format, you can also repurpose into other formats. For example, a couple of the episodes that I’ve done over the last few months here on the podcast started out as blog posts, evergreen pieces of content that I’d already published on the blog. Once you’ve got an evergreen piece of content that’s working, one of the things you should be considering is what other mediums could I be repurposing that content into?

    Evergreen content is also the type of content that you’ll find other bloggers will want to link to as well. That’s a good thing for you as well.

    There’s a whole heap of reasons as to why evergreen content is well worth investing your time into.

    How much of the content in my archives does fit this category? As I look back at the content and look at how it’s performed over time, many times it’s very steady in terms of the graph that we see in Google Analytics. It steadily tends to grow over time. I want to give you a couple of examples of this from Digital Photography School to contrast two types of content, the evergreen versus the now.

    Last year on Digital Photography School, we published a post that was all about Adobe announcing that they released a new version of Lightroom, Lightroom CC. We did a blog post on this. This is what I would classify as now content, this was big news in our community, Lightroom is the biggest post processing tool that our readers use. It was massive news. The post did really well for us. In the first week that that post went live, we had twelve-thousand page views. It was really good, it was a successful piece of content. The first day it went live, it had about three thousand page views. Later in the week when we sent our newsletter, it had three-thousand five-hundred, four-thousand page views, all during that week had a lot. Twelve-thousand in the first week. That’s what I would consider a successful post in its first week.

    But then, traffic tailed off. As I look back on it, it’s a bit over a year since that post was published. That post yesterday had two readers. One of them was me going back to have a look at the post, so it had really one reader. Since the time it was published, after the first week, it’s had probably a total of about a thousand page views in a year. Really, most of that came in the second and third week after it went live.

    That’s an example of a piece of content that dates and that’s pretty typical as I look at reviews of cameras, as I look at posts about breaking news. If you’ve got a blog that has that type of content, you’ll probably see the same trends. You might be able to lengthen the amount of time that people go back to that by re-sharing on social media a few times but it’s the type of content that doesn’t tend to attract much traffic.

    I want you to contrast that pattern of traffic with another post that I wrote back in 2007. This post is again on Digital Photography School and I’ll link to both of these in the show notes today. This was a post which was an introduction to a concept in photography called ISO. If you’ve got a film camera back at home, you’ll remember that film used to have ISO over a certain number. This is a blog post which explains what ISO means and what it particularly means for digital photography today.

    The day that post went live back in 2007, the blog was a smaller blog back then. It had 100 page views. Then, it tapered off. It actually went down after that first week, after it appeared in the news, it kind of tapered off. I was getting about 40 to 50 visitors a day. Fairly similar pattern to the second and third week to the Lightroom post that I just shared with you.

    But then, things began to grow. Twelve months after that blog post was published, in 2008, it was getting two-hundred to three-hundred page views per day. Two years after it was published, it was getting seven-hundred page views a day. Three years after it was published, it was getting one-thousand page views a day. Since that time, it’s remained at about that level between one-thousand and one-thousand five-hundred per day with the exception of a few days where I’ve re-shared it on social media because we do re-share this post at least a couple of times a year on Facebook because it’s as relevant today as it used to be. On those days, it can get up to ten-thousand if things really go well for it in a particular day.

    As I look back, since 2007, that blog post has continued to grow. It’s kind of plateaued a little bit now at a thousand to one-thousand five-hundred per day. That’s kind of where it’s still sitting today. As I look back over that time, it’s had over three-million page views to it. I wrote the post in 2007, it’s getting ten to fifteen times the traffic today as it did on the day that I published it. It continues to be valuable for my readers, it continues to drive traffic largely from search engines, but it’s also getting traffic every time I re-share it on social media and other people share it on social media. It’s the type of post that other people link to when they want to explain to their readers what ISO is which only continues to help it to grow.

    Both posts probably took me about an hour, maybe two hours to write. The first one, the Lightroom one, was actually one of our authors who wrote it. I don’t know exactly how long they took to write it, but that post was around eleven-hundred words long. My post on ISO, the evergreen one, was seven-hundred words long. They were fairly significant pieces of content but they probably only took a couple of hours to write.

    Obviously, the investment of time and effort on the ISO post, the evergreen piece of content, was much, much better than on the Lightroom post, the now piece of content. That’s not to say that there’s anything wrong with writing about the issues of today, things that will date. We do do those types of posts. The vast majority of what we focus our attention on on both Digital Photography School and ProBlogger is evergreen content. It just does not even compare in terms of the payoff from the investment of time.

    What I want to do now is share with you a few examples of evergreen pieces of content because I know every time I bring this topic up, some people say to me, “I just can’t do evergreen content on my blog.” I want to share with you some of the examples of content that I’ve created on both Digital Photography School and ProBlogger partly to give you a bit of an example of some of the types of things that were done and some of them might stimulate some ideas for you.

    After I give you the examples, I want to give you some tips on how to identify evergreen opportunities for content particularly on those blogs where it’s not as obvious. Let’s start with some examples.

    Yesterday, I spent a bit of time going back into Google Analytics and I pulled up the Top 10 posts on ProBlogger and Digital Photography School in terms of traffic. I pulled out the Top 5 from both ProBlogger and Digital Photography School to share with you. Let’s kind of work back through these from the most popular.

    The most popular post that I’ve published on Digital Photography School is a post called Ten Ways To Take Stunning Portraits. I’ll link to all of these in the show notes at where you can take a look at these. This particular post is pretty typical of a lot of the posts that we’ve got over on Digital Photography School. It’s a fairly introductory type guide to a subtopic in Digital Photography School. We talk about Landscape Photography, Macro Photography, but Portrait Photography is probably the biggest category of posts that we have on the blog. This post is an introduction to Portrait Photography.

    I have a lot of posts on Portrait Photography but this one kind of gets into some of the basics of that big topic. The post is long-ish, it’s probably around one-thousand four-hundred words. It’s not a massive long-mega post, but it’s meaty enough that there’s some content there. I do find that search engines do tend to like content that is a little bit longer. Anything over a thousand words is going to be treated as sort of a slightly more meaty post.

    You look at that post and you’ll see it’s in the list format. It covers ten points and for each point, I only really touch on the idea. I don’t go into great depth for each point. For each point, I link to further reading. This is a technique I like to use, I’ve talked about this on the podcast before. I would classify this as a sneeze post, the idea is that you’re sneezing people deep within your blog in all different directions. For everyone of the ten points that I make in the post, there’s a paragraph or two and then there’s usually a picture to help give it some visual interest and then I sneeze people deep into the archives. Hopefully by the end of reading this post, I might’ve read three or four or maybe all ten of the further pieces of reading which does increase the chance that they will subscribe as well to the blog.

    This post really worked really well because it was an introductory type post to a major category on the blog. I’ve done this same thing for Landscape Photography, Macro Photography, Wedding Photography. All of those main things that we find our readers come for, there’s this type of post on the site. It’s a topic that is not going away. People will always continue to take pictures of people and the principles that I talk about are evergreen principles. They’re not current trends in Portrait Photography, these are tips that you can use today and hopefully you’ll still be able to use in ten years.

    I think this post worked because it’s got some stuff in it that you can apply immediately after reading it. It’s actionable, it’s practical, and there’s more there if you want to read. There’s a further reading on each of the posts.

    Another reason that this one did well is that I followed it up with a second post, so there’s another post and you’ll see it at the bottom of the post as an update, Ten More Tips Or Ways To Take Stunning Photos. The reason that helps its evergreen nature is that that second post drove people back to the first one. People, when they link to my content here, this particular post, they have to link to both of them. That just drives more traffic as well.

    I think the last reason that this one particularly worked is because it was written in a fairly accessible style. People like lists, it’s scannable, there’s lots of images, it’s not too heavy. That’s the first post. It’s a teaching post I guess you would say, an introductory teaching post to the topic.

    The second one I want to share with you is a little bit different. It is titled The Rule of Thirds. This, I would say, is a little bit different for a number of reasons. Firstly, it’s not as long. It’s only about six-hundred words long so it’s getting towards the shorter end of the type of post that we write on the site. You don’t have to write long form content, I know Tim if you listened to the rest of his podcast, you’ll see that he writes fifteen page long articles. His podcasts go for an hour, two hours some of them. He really believes in long form content and I do too but I also think that you can do evergreen content that is shorter form as well. Again, it’s not super short but six-hundred words, we’re getting a bit shorter now.

    The other thing that this post is different for is that it’s not a teaching post, really. It does teach you but it’s more of a definition post. It’s not a how to do it type post like the first one, it’s more of a what is a type post. The rule of thirds is a principle of photography, many of you will have been taught it as kids, it’s a rule of composition. It does touch on how to apply the rule, it’s more about defining what this rule is. I find that definition posts are a great way of doing evergreen content in most niches. I would say there are terminologies, there are phrases that we use that an introductory type reader, a beginner reader doesn’t understand.

    I would suggest that most of the readers that have come to this post over the years have typed into Google what is the rule of thirds. We come up number one or two depending on how Google’s ranking is on the day for that particular type of term.

    On ProBlogger, we do posts like this as well. One of the good pieces of content didn’t make Top 10 but we get a lot of traffic to on ProBlogger is a post that I wrote called What Is A Blog? You might think that’s the most silly post to write but it’s amazing how many people type that into Google.

    Other terms that are relevant for your niche that you could write a post defining those words or explaining what those types of things are. This really can drive a lot of traffic. That post, the rule of thirds post, has had over two and a half million people come to it.

    I got a third example, another one from Digital Photography School is a post called How To Make An Inexpensive Light Tent. Again, link to it in the show notes. This one’s around eleven-hundred words long. This is a classic step by step post. It’s teaching people how to do something, lots of images at each step along the way.

    This post worked for a number of reasons. One, it’s a teaching post. Again, this is what I like to do. I like to teach people how to do things. Anything that’s a step by step guide works very well and these DIY projects really work for us as well.

    The other reason that I know this post has worked is a lot of our readers came back to it again. That just drives people back again and again over time. I know a number of our readers bookmarked this particular post. When they first read it, they didn’t want to make it straight away but they came back to it later. It’s the type of thing that they share as well which really does help with that evergreen nature of it.

    For some reason, this post really lived on in the minds of a lot of our readers and I continued to today see people sharing this post on Twitter with their friends. I guess if it comes up in conversation that one of their friends is wanting to have a light tent which is just a piece of equipment for photography, I guess it just comes to mind for people. So if you can create something that’s memorable and that people will refer back to again and again, that can work particularly well.

    Example number four is a post called Long Exposure Photography, 15 Stunning Examples. I wanted to include this one because it’s only two-hundred words long. This is really short form content here. I guess it is longish in some ways because it’s got images in it. This post is one that I have shared on the podcast before, it’s just fifteen inspirational images that illustrate a particular technique in photography.

    Evergreen content doesn’t’ have to be a teaching post, it doesn’t even have to have a lot of words, it can be purely image. I just wanted to include this one because it is an example of something that is a little bit different but it continues to be evergreen. Those images, if you choose the right images, they can live on as being something that inspires people for many years to come. I guess in some ways this is a bit of a case study post. Here’s what other people have done with this technique.

    Number five, this is the last one I’ll give you from Digital Photography School. I want to share some ProBlogger ones with you next. This one is called Posing Guide – 21 Samples Poses to Get You Started with Photographing Women. This is nine-hundred words long, getting a little longer here. But again, this one has lots of images. It’s got twenty-one images in it. This was actually part of a series of blog posts. Again, it’s another example where evergreen content within a series, or the links from one post to another, can really work very well. You end up with quite a large collection. I think we had eight or nine different posts in this series. We had Posing Guide – 21 Sample Poses To Help You with photographing women, men, couples, kids, and different situations as well.

    Again, this is an example where it’s words and images together. It’s not so much a teaching post, it’s more of a how I did it or a case study type post. The other thing that we found with this post is that it’s one that people save to their iPads and took out with them when they’re photographing women so they can show people the particular poses. If you can create something that people will read more than once, that increases the evergreen nature of it as well and increases the amount of pageviews that that particular post will get. That post had around two-million people hit it. I think it was published back in 2010, so it’s about five or six years old now.

    Five more examples, these ones will come from ProBlogger.

    The next one I’ll talk about is one called Can You Really Make Money Blogging – 7 Things I Know About Making Money Blogging. Many of you have seen this post over on ProBlogger because it’s one of the most read posts that we’ve ever done. It’s a longish post, it’s about two-thousand words long, fairly long form content there. This is an example of a frequently asked question. I think if you can identify any frequently asked question within your niche, any question that you get from your readers via email or comments or any critique that you have of your particular niche. I saw a lot of people saying you can’t really make money blogging so this was my answer to that statement or to those questions.

    It’s a list post so there’s seven things I know about this particular topic. It’s the type of post that I link back to constantly from other posts on ProBlogger. You will see me link to it, you will see me mention it in podcasts. I link back to it and that increases the evergreen nature of it by getting people back to that post again and again. Every time you get people back to the post, it increases the chances that you will be shared again or it might be linked to which then helps your SEO. It’s one of those things that can snowball over time as your post grows.

    The other thing I’ll tell you about this one is a bit of a myth busting post. If there’s a myth within your industry that won’t go away, that’s an ideal topic that you should be writing about because it’s evergreen.

    The next post I want to talk about briefly is my mega post, one of the longest posts I’ve ever written called The Ultimate Guide to Making Money with the Amazon Affiliate Program. Again, this is one that you will probably have seen if you’ve been reading ProBlogger for a while because it continues to rank really well in Google and it gets shared heaps. I know Amazon actually shared this with a lot of their affiliates because it was such a mega post, it’s seven-thousand seven-hundred words long. As a result of being so long, people bookmark it, they save it for later, they come back to it, they save it in Facebook which must be a signal to Facebook that it ranks well. It’s a type of post that people share like crazy, it’s been linked to a lot from different blogs including Amazon themselves. It’s also something I refer back to time and time again. Those things all come together to make it something that’s quite powerful.

    A few of the techniques that I mention in this particular post have slightly dated, I don’t do them anymore. I updated this post and that’s one of the things I’ll talk about in a moment. You can actually link from the evergreen nature of a post by changing it. I’m totally fine with that and I’ll talk a little bit more about that in a moment.

    The eighth one that I want to share with you quickly now is a post called How to Craft a Blog Post – 10 Crucial Points to Pause. This was a post that is a little bit different to some of the others because it’s an introduction to a series of posts that I published over several weeks. If you go and look at it, the post itself is just the introduction, it just raises what I’m going to do next. And then, I link to all the other ten posts in the series.

    As I release new posts, I would update this post to include the link to it. It’s kind of like the hub of a series. It doesn’t have a heap of content in it of itself, about eight-hundred words, it’s not tiny. It acts more as a central hub for the rest of the series. Again, it’s on a topic that’s evergreen, how to write a blog post. The ten things that I mention are all as relevant today as they were back in 2008 when I published this post. It’s one of those ones that has really steadily grown in terms of the traffic that has come to this post but also to the other ten posts in the series as well.

    I’ll link to this one particularly from the portals around ProBloggers as well so I’m not only relying upon Google to send traffic to it but I’m also sending traffic to it from navigation areas and our portals on the blog as well. I think that’s really important to think about not just relying upon Google but actually helping get people to these evergreen posts as well.

    The ninth one that I want to share with you is a little bit different again, it’s called How to Quit Your Job, Move to Paradise, and Get Paid to Change the World. It sounds like a bit of an aspirational post and it is. It’s actually a guest post that John Murrow wrote. I really would recommend that you go back and read it because it’s just a story. This is another example of a different type of content, it doesn’t have to be teaching, it doesn’t have to be a case study, it doesn’t have to be a definition type post. This is a story. If you’ve got a story or you know a good story that’s relevant for all time like this particular one is, that’s a great type of evergreen content that you could be creating for your blog as well. It doesn’t date, it inspires people as much today as it did in 2011 when we first published it on ProBlogger.

    The last one I want to give you is kind of one that was a bit of surprise. As I looked at the most read posts on ProBlogger, I didn’t realize this post was getting so much traffic even today. It’s Ten David Ogilvy Quotes that could Revolutionize Your Blogging. It’s a post I wrote back in 2011 and it was just a collection of my favorite quotes from David Ogilvy who’s sort of like the original Ad Man. It’s fifteen-hundred words long so I did add a little bit of my own content. It’s fairly large, it’s not a meaty post at all. I guess people still are searching today many, many years later for quotes from David Ogilvy. I suspect that’s where the traffic is coming in from.

    They’re just ten of the examples that I’ve done. As I mentioned earlier, I’ve got some examples on the show notes today from some of our readers, some ProBlogger readers. I actually put on my Facebook page a few days ago now that I was doing this podcast and I wanted examples of other evergreen content from other blogs. There’s a whole collection of all kinds of different content there. I wanted to include these probably to drive a little bit of traffic to ProBlogger readers, I love to share traffic with our readers. But two, also because I wanted to show you some examples of evergreen content from different niches. Some of these are teaching type posts and some of them are different styles of content as well.

    I know for a fact that some of you are still going, “This doesn’t really work for my niche.” I kind of want to address that a little bit now. Evergreen content can take all kinds of forms. You’ve already seen some of the different styles of content, the different types of posts that I’ve shared. We’ve got how to, instructional guides, that’s where I spend a lot of my time. You’ve got definition type posts, you’ve got inspirational content—some of those image collections that I shared but also the story that we shared—case studies and examples—sometimes, they can date a little bit but sometimes they don’t. Advice, we got a post on ProBlogger, How to Choose a Blog Platform. That’s a piece of content that hasn’t really dated a whole heap although some of the platforms have changed, we’ve updated it a little bit, but it’s a question that people continue to ask. It answers to frequently asked questions. The last type would be swipe files or templates. I’ll share an example in a moment from Copy Blogger that fits into that category.

    Again, you can also see this even in the examples I’ve given you. There’s been different styles or formats of posts as well. Step by step, list post, essays, articles, all kinds of image collections. We’ve got different mediums there, evergreen content can be written content, audio, many of the podcasts that I’ve created including this one remain as relevant today as they were when I recorded them and hopefully will live on for a long time to come. Video can be evergreen. Really, you’re not limited to just the written work here.

    I’ve got a post on YouTube, a video that I did on my secrets to making money from blogging. I referred to that a couple of episodes ago and it continues to get views even today. Video can work as well. Different styles, different mediums, different types of posts all can work as evergreen content. You’re not limited just to a written content.

    How do you identify evergreen content ideas for your particular blog? I want to make a few suggestions for you and hopefully some of these again will stimulate some ideas for you.

    The first question is what questions do you get asked today that you’ve been asked for a few years now? What questions do you get asked that just don’t go away. An example of that on ProBlogger was can you really make money blogging? That’s one question. Another one we get asked all the time is how do you make money blogging. Some of the best posts that we’ve got on ProBlogger just answer those frequently asked questions.

    What are the key challenges, obstacles, or problems that don’t go away for your readers? Again, on ProBlogger, one of the key challenges is that our readers have and hasn’t gone away is productivity. How do I fit it all in? How do I get it all done? You’ll notice a lot of the content that I’ve created on ProBlogger does take that angle. How do you get it all done? How do you decide which social media network to go on, that was two episodes ago. What are those challenges, obstacles, and problems that your readers have that just haven’t gone away? That type of content that addresses those types of challenges will lend itself to more evergreen content.

    What searches are people doing on your site to get to your site? If you can get some of that information from Google Analytics, you want to dig in a little bit too to see what people are searching for when they’re on your site. What searches are people doing on your topic elsewhere? You might want to look at Google Trends as a good tool for that. You can type in a keyword there and it will show you whether that keyword is being searched for on Google and whether that’s trending up or trending down type of topic.

    What are the cornerstone things that people need to know in your niche? A good example of that on Digital Photography School was that ISO post. I wrote a series of posts back in 2007 I think it was on Digital Photography School on the topics of aperture, shutter speed and ISO. Those three concepts are what I would consider to be cornerstone pieces of content. If you want to take a well exposed photo, you need to learn those three things. Those ideas are cornerstone to the topic.

    If there are cornerstone things that you constantly are referring to in your articles, then maybe you’ve never even written on those posts because you think they’re so basic for everyone. They’re the type of things that you should be writing content on. You should always link back to those things.

    What are the key categories in your niche that you could write an introduction on? What could you create that people will come back to again and again? A good example of this, when I do go on Facebook for people to share examples, Carla and Emma from The Merrymaker Sisters shared a recipe that has sent them heaps of traffic to their particular blog The Merrymaker Sisters. It’s called The Paleo Salted Caramel Slice Recipe. It’s such an amazing slice, I’ve actually tasted it, that I bet people are constantly coming back to it. It’s one that they would live on in their memories that they come back to again and again and again. If they don’t print it out and put it in their most used recipes.

    Those types of things that you create that people come back to is really important. Hence, swipe files is another example of this. Copy Blogger is one of my favorite blogs over at Brian Clark wrote an article back in 2008 or 2009 on his Ten Surefire Headline Formats that Always Work. These were just sort of little templates of headlines that you could use for blog posts. That post, it’s just become iconic. People constantly refer to it and I constantly go back to it. Every time I’m stuck writing a blog post title or trying to name an ebook or trying to come up with a headline for a landing page, I go back to that post. If you can create something that has some sort of a swipe file element to it that people will keep coming back to, then that’s the type of thing that maybe you should be trying to create on your blog as well.

    The last thing I’d say is to try to help you identify evergreen content ideas. What key stories have there been in your life or in your industry, in your niche, that continue to have relevance today, things that continue to teach and inspire your readers today.

    I think in most of our lives, there’s moments in our lives that have been turning point moments for us. We often refer back to them in passing. I really would encourage you to identify what were the turning point moments in your own life that you do occasionally refer to on your blog. Write that up as a blog post, write that story up, and then you can link back to that and drive traffic back to that over time. That’s another evergreen idea.

    The last question I want to touch on with evergreen content, it’s a question I get quite a bit. “What should I do if my content dates?” There are plenty of blogs as I mentioned before that just purely do now content. On one level, that’s totally okay. I want to say if you got a blog that’s all about now content, maybe you’ve got a news blog or maybe you’ve got a politics blog that’s all about the election that’s happening in the US at the moment, or if you’ve got a blog that’s all about gadgets and you have to just constantly write about now stuff, that’s okay. But, keep your eyes open for opportunities to add some evergreen content. I do think in most niches there’s opportunities to create evergreen content.

    What I would say to you is look for opportunities to mix it up. Not every content you write needs to be evergreen and not every content idea that you have needs to be now. Most blogs can create a mix of that. It will differ from blog to blog what that mix is.

    Over on Digital Photography School, I would say 90% to 95% is evergreen. We could write a lot more about the new cameras that come out and the new techniques that there are for getting certain styles of post processing and we do do a few of those types of things but we tend to leave that to other blogs that are majoring more upon that.

    On ProBlogger, we tend to do a little bit more now content because techniques do change. For example, we’ve written more recently about Snapchat. We’ve written more recently about Facebook Live, some of these emerging trends that are a heat for a while. I would say they’re still reasonably evergreen but they may be not as evergreen as some of the posts that we do on Digital Photography School.

    I guess that’s one of the things that we should acknowledge, really evergreen content is a spectrum. Some pieces of content that you write might last ten years, it might last a hundred years really. Some of those principles of life just don’t change but there’s a sliding scale. Some pieces are now and they’re today type content and they will not be relevant tomorrow. And then, a lot of pieces of content, on ProBlogger, posts about Snapchat may only be around for six months or so, that’s more evergreen than just a today type of content. Do consider those types of posts as well, the medium level evergreen.

    The last thing I’ll say is that you can update your content to make it more evergreen. I’ve already kind of mentioned this as well. Even the post that are dating, look back at them and ask yourself are there opportunities to go back to some of those olds posts and update them?

    A good example of this on ProBlogger is my post How to Make Money Blogging. I think you’ll find it at It’s about two-thousand nine-hundred words long. I can’t remember when I wrote that post, I think it must’ve been back in 2007, 2008 when I kind of summarized how I made money blogging. If you go back in the web archives and look at the different versions of that post that have been online, you will notice that they have changed quite a bit. I’ve gone back to that post again and again and again and updated it and changed it. Probably very little of it is still what I actually wrote when I first published that post. Yet, I would still consider that to be an evergreen piece of content because it’s still the same topic.

    Whilst the content on it has changed with the times, people still are asking about how to make money blogging. The topic hasn’t changed and the page URL hasn’t’ changed. It continues to rank well in Google as well. You may have some content in your archives that you could tweak and update a little bit and it becomes evergreen again today. Particularly pay attention to content that is doing well in Google or that is getting a lot of traffic from another blog. If you’ve got a hot post like that in your archives, really make it a high priority to continue to update that one.

    There are also other things that you might want to do some analysis on. There are things within your niche that readers continue to come looking for. I’ll give you a couple of examples of this. One of my favorite blogs to read is Mac Rumors. It’s a blog about the new things that are rumored to be happening with Apple and Mac, new iPhones that might be coming out, new features that might be on the next MacBook Pro. I would consider most of the content that goes up on Mac Rumors to be very now, it’s all now, it’s all stuff that could be obsolete tomorrow. As that rumor gets proved to be false or as the new iPhone comes out, those posts that are being written about it really become obsolete.

    But as I look at Mac Rumors, they have worked out that there are some things that people just come constantly looking for advice on. If you look up in their navigation area, they’ve got a link called Buyer’s Guide. It’s the buyer’s guide to all Apple Products. One of the things I guess they’ve realized is that their readers get really nervous about whether they should buy a product now or whether they should wait a month or two before the new product comes out. If you look at the buyer’s guide, it actually gives you the latest information on that particular product. This is a page that they’ve created that gives you up to date information on an evergreen topic. I guess that’s the point I’m trying to make here today is are there things that your readers constantly are asking, I suspect they created that page because people kept asking in their forms. It’s now the right time to buy this particular product.

    They created a guide for that and they constantly update it, it gets updated probably everyday almost. It’s an evergreen kind of page because it’s fulfilling a need that is not going away in their readers. You might find that there is just something that all your readers want to be kept up to date on so then you can create a page that’s a little bit evergreen there.

    Another example of a blog that I read quite regularly that does this is Life Hacker. If you go to Life Hacker, you will see different versions of Life Hacker depending on where you are in the world. If you go to the US Life Hacker page, you’ll find that they have some links to the most essential apps for Macs. I’ll give you the link to that in today’s show notes. It’s a post that they update constantly with their favorite apps for Macs.

    They’ve obviously worked out that there’s high demand that’s not going away for that particular topic. So if you look at that post, you’ll see that some of the comments are from 2013. That post has been live for a long time but it’s been updated in the last few days and they do say when they update it as well. If there’s something that people just keep asking you about, it’s a problem that your readers have that’s just not going away, consider creating a page that you’ll update that really fulfills the evergreen kind of need that people have as well.

    Two more quick examples. I’ll shoot you over to Digital Photography School again. We’ve got a couple of posts there that are our most popular Digital SLRs, most popular lenses, most popular compact cameras. I’ve shared the links in the show notes. These are posts that I update probably once a quarter, so three or four times a year. It just shows the current trends in those particular things.

    I noticed a few years ago that people are constantly asking what digital SLR should I buy? I could spend all day answering that question or I could create a page that simply answers the question for our readers. Again, it’s an evergreen question but I update the content. That might be something that you can do. If you’ve got a blog that is on one of these sort of now, now, now type topics, maybe there are some things that you can do to create some evergreen content.

    Last one I’ll share with you as an example is from Vanessa’s blog, my wife. Stole Shenanigans is her blog. She wrote a post called Where to Shop in Bali after we took a holiday there. I don’t know that she really expected that post to do as well as it has, but it’s one that has ranked pretty well in Google and yet it does date. Where to Shop in Bali does change from month to month, year to year. We’ve been back to Bali several times now, and she’s gone back even by herself on a girl’s kind of holiday for a significant birthday that she had. Every time she goes back, she collects more information on that particular topic and then updates that post.

    You might have a post that dates but are there ways that you can continue to update that one?

    There are some ideas on how to create evergreen content for your blog. Creating it is half the blog, the next thing you really do need to think about is how do you get people to it. Once you’ve written your evergreen piece of content, think about how you’re going to get your readers to it. Whilst some noble post might have a spike in traffic and then die off very quickly, the goal with evergreen content is to get a steady stream of traffic to it overtime.

    A few tips on how to do that. Partly, it’s going to be up to Google, Google does have their way of determining where to rank traffic. I guess the first thing is learn how to do some SEO, how can you optimize your post for SEO. I’ll link in today’s show notes to an episode that we did on search engine optimization that Jim Stewart on that particular topic.

    Optimize your post for SEO but then consider how you can get people to it from your blog, your existing blog. Your navigation areas, your menu, your sidebar. If it’s an important piece of evergreen content, you probably want to highlight that post in some way on your blog. On ProBlogger, I mentioned already on our sidebar next to blog post we have linked to some of our important pieces of evergreen content, we have portals, we link to some of our important evergreen pieces of content from the about page, the start here page.

    Also, underneath blog posts we have further reading which we recommend certain pieces of content that people should read as well. Go back through your archives and work out are there other relevant pieces of content that you could be linking to your new evergreen content from. Even if it’s just sending a trickle of traffic from ten different blog posts, that adds up over time.

    You can regularly re-share that social media content again and again. Build a system where you’re highlighting that type of content. One very simple thing that I do pretty much every day is go back to look at what I published this day last year and this day two years ago. The date today as I’m recording this is July 25. Tonight when I do my social media for Digital Photography School, I curate all the content that goes up onto our Facebook page, I will look at what I published on the 25th of July last year and every year over the last five or six years. I’ll be looking for opportunities as I do that to find evergreen content.

    I don’t share every post that we published on the 25th of July because some of it wasn’t evergreen. But if it’s evergreen and it’s still relevant today, I use that as a single to myself to re-share. I know every year, I go through every post on the site. If it’s evergreen, it gets shared at least once a year. Build a system where you can resurface that evergreen content.

    Keep in mind as you write future pieces of content that there will be opportunities to link back to your evergreen content in that. Before you publish any new blog post, ask yourself is there something I’ve written before that’s evergreen that I should be linking back to? You should be linking to your evergreen content in any promotional activities you do. If you are guest posting on someone else’s blog, don’t just link back to your front page in your bio. You might want to consider linking back to an evergreen piece of content that relates to what you wrote about in that guest post. If you’re interviewed on a podcast or if you get an interview in the media, try and find a way to mention that piece of content that you’ve created and drive people back from that.

    I guess the last thing is if you’ve got a piece of content that’s evergreen, consider who might be interested in that. Is there a social media influencer in your particular niche who might actually like and might share that piece of content as well?

    Promote your evergreen content. Don’t just write it, that’s half the battle, but get people to it and work it. It’s really important to continue to do that.

    The last thing I’ll say about evergreen content is that once you got people viewing it and once you have that steady stream of traffic to those posts, you’ve got to ask yourself what’s the point of that? If people are seeing that content and then they’re bouncing straight off your site again, that’s kind of a bit of a wasted opportunity so how can you leverage the eyeballs that that evergreen content are getting?

    You might want to consider creating an opt-in or lead magnet where you give something away in return for an email address from the people who do come to that. You might want to get people to read a second piece of content. If you’ve got an evergreen piece of content that’s getting lots of eyeballs, you might want to suggest some further reading on that to get a second eyeball on a second piece of content. You might want to call them to follow you on social media.

    Really, it’s about trying to make that piece of content that is evergreen, that is getting the traffic, as sticky as possible. I put together an episode purely on that topic of making your blog post sticky. It’s Episode 35 of the ProBlogger podcast and I really would encourage you to go back and listen to that one once this particular episode is finished. If you’ve already got evergreen content that’s ranking in Google, that’s getting traffic from social, that’s getting traffic from other blogs, you really need to take a good look at that piece of content and see how can I leverage that piece of content. You’re going to listen to Episode 35 on that.

    Just to sum up, evergreen content is one of the best investments that you’ll ever make in terms of creating content for your blog. Not every piece of content needs to be evergreen and not every piece of evergreen content that you create is going to work. Sometimes, they just don’t attract the traffic that we think. But the more evergreen content you create over time, the better.

    I shared with you earlier in this podcast ten pieces of content that have done really well for me on my blogs. Those pieces of content, some of them have had millions of pageviews but none of them have made up any more than 1% or 2% of my overall traffic. The reality is that all of the hundreds of millions of pageviews that I’ve had over the years, most of it has come from all the little pieces of content that I’ve created that have been evergreen. Really, it’s about the accumulation of what’s in your archives that matters with this. It’s not just those big posts that go viral, it’s some of those little posts as well that might attract an extra ten, twenty, thirty visitors a month to your blog; those add up over time.

    Every piece of content that you create is an investment that continues to drive the overall traffic that you’re able to drive to your blogs. I really do encourage you this week to make it your goal to create some evergreen content and identify some other topics that you might want to write that are evergreen in nature. Actually, come up with a bit of a schedule to create that content over the coming weeks and months.

    Thanks so much for listening to today. I know it’s been a long one. It actually took me forever to prepare this one, there’s so much to say on the topic. You can find today’s show notes with all the further reading, all the examples that I’ve given you, and a full transcription of this whole podcast over at Thanks for listening, I’ll chat with you in a couple of days time in Episode 137. 

    How did you go with today’s episode?

    I hope you are building evergreen content into your weekly or even daily schedule. I would love to know what type of evergreen content you have published and how it is working for you. Share your experiences below.

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    "It’s not about being eight hours in an office. It’s about increasing the quality of the hours that you spend." - David "DHH" Heinemeier Hansson David "DHH" Heinemeier Hansson (@dhh) is the creator of Ruby on Rails, founder and CTO at Basecamp (formerly 37signals), and the best-selling co-autho…

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